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Forum week 2

Page history last edited by marina gonzalez 10 years, 4 months ago

Don't forget to post your opinions, questions or doubts in the comments section below.


Here is the transcript of today's chat. Pity we lost connection with George and Maria belen too quickly! Thanks Heidi and Elena for being there. Hope to meet more of you with doubts next week.

 chat transcript undeited 23 jan.docx   We kept all the first 20 min  of tech org for you not to feel afraid, we are always tackling with the unexpected!

(my excuses for the typos, my dyslexia attacks when I'm in a hurry!) 


Comments (24)

Bia Hedegaard said

at 1:41 pm on Jan 19, 2014

Hello everyone!
Am I at the wrong place? Where are all the comments about Week 2? I couldn't find any of the pages that participants were supposed to create here in the Wiki either.
I've been very busy this week so I've just started Week 2 activities today.
I feel like I'm in one of my favorite The Police songs: "I'm sending an S.O.S. to the world. I hope that someone gets my message in a bottle..." haha

marina gonzalez said

at 8:00 pm on Jan 19, 2014

Dear Bia, we were just finishing week 1, that's all. We are expected to share our ideas on projects during this week, feel free to be the first!!
Thanks for your enthusiasm!

Bia Hedegaard said

at 7:12 am on Jan 27, 2014

Hi Marina,
I haven't put my project on the wiki yet, but I will. I may lack time, but the will is still high.
"See" you around...

Andy Hockley said

at 3:28 am on Jan 20, 2014

Hi Bia, Week 2 starts here!

To make your own page (ie your own project) just click where it says "Create a page" in the top right hand corner


Elena said

at 4:12 am on Jan 20, 2014

Elena Iarkova
What is wrong about objectives mentioned: 1.To improve the English of 7-10 year olds by June 2014.
Although it might seem to sound specific, it is still too general. We don't mention the level of our learners English abilities, i.e, do we want them to achieve Elementary or Pre-Intermediate? Where are we going to do it? How are we going to measure the process, will their be a progress achievement test offered at the end? What specific skills: Reading, Writing, Speaking, Listening will we focus on?
2. To enable 96% of those who wish ..... to enter the University of their choice by September 2014.
This objective also doesn't sound too clear to me. Where are you going to put it into pratice? Who will be responsible for this? How will you be able to achieve it? Why 96% not 90 or 95% Is it realistic to measure?
3. To build a nice wheelchai ramp. This is not specific at all.When, who, whre, scope.. details are not taken into account. What is nice for some people will not be the same for other ones. "Nice" should be described more precisely/
4. To improve access to the building. It doesn't comply with S.M.A.R.T procedure as well.

Lada Smirnova said

at 5:31 pm on Jan 20, 2014

Hi Elens and all,
Elena, cannot agree more with your analysis of 4 stances. It seems they're just fine as goals and need more 'down to earth' improvement to sound like objectives. For instance, 1st and 2nd objectives are lack of means, then they would benefit from reformulating objectives to start with sth like “By June 2014 the learners will be able to write an invitation letter …etc.’, i.e. a sort of well-known ‘Can-Do’ statements.

Lada Smirnova said

at 5:51 pm on Jan 20, 2014

Here is the link to my problem- goal-objectives start: http://projectmanagementevo2014participants.pbworks.com/w/page/73293353/Lada%27s%20project
Would love to get your feedback ;-)

marina gonzalez said

at 12:57 pm on Jan 23, 2014

Interesting point you've both made as regards the difference between goals and objectives! Breaking down goals into objectives is THE challenge from my humble standpoint.

Sarah Hillyard said

at 6:38 pm on Jan 23, 2014

maciss03@... said

at 10:27 am on Jan 24, 2014

Hi everybody!
I'd like to know if the project we are going to present has necessarily to deal with designing or managing.
I need more informations so as to tackle my issue.

My best regards!

CISS Mamadou

Andy Hockley said

at 12:11 pm on Jan 24, 2014

Hi Mamadou. I'm not sure I entirely understand the question. This course will (we hope) take you through the process of effectively designing a project. Though of course much of the work of project design is about putting things in place such that it is easy to manage. Does that help? I'm not really sure!


Elena said

at 3:06 am on Jan 25, 2014

Elena Iarkova. I'd like to comment on the tools for the projectmanagement. They all sound to be effective in putting projects into practice, however, dowloading the software takes much time, and unfortunatelly I couldn't finish downloading Project Libre and Ganib, my computer didn't allow me to do it for certain reasons. Whereas Project Gantt Chart was rather quick and I managed to make a copy of the template and hope to use it in my work. It is quite simple and clear, so, I will be able to follow my students activities and check all the deadlines in time. It will definitely contribute to organizing the project process more efficiently.
I personally liked www.projectagency.co.uk blank project management templates best of all. They are easy to use and help to build up the prject mangement process step by step in a very systematic way, thank you for sharing them!

Andy Hockley said

at 4:14 am on Jan 25, 2014

Thanks for the feedback Elena, and sorry to hear that two of the tools couldn't be downloaded. Is that true for everyone? It would be good to know, so I can stop suggesting them!

Bia Hedegaard said

at 7:52 am on Jan 27, 2014

Hi Elena,
I found the project agency page but not the templates you've mentioned. Would please send me a link to it?
Thanks a lot!

Andy Hockley said

at 8:15 am on Jan 27, 2014

They are linked here Bia, on the "General links and documents" page of the course: http://projectmanagementevo2014.pbworks.com/w/page/72580559/General%20links%20and%20documents%20of%20interest

Bia Hedegaard said

at 8:50 am on Jan 27, 2014

Thanks Andy! I had seen the other tools, but somehow skipped that link.

Talat said

at 5:01 am on Jan 25, 2014

Hi everyone!
I have explored Project Libre, it's really userfriendly . I guess It'll be fine for my project.

Talat said

at 5:07 am on Jan 25, 2014

Corrections in objectives:
1) It is unrealistic and not accurate
2) Unrealistic as 96% is a high no. to attain
3) No time mentioned, not accurate, not specific as ' nice' doesn't tells what kind
4) Not specific, can't be measured and time not given.

Lada Smirnova said

at 8:54 am on Jan 25, 2014

Hi Elena and all,
Didn't have enough time to play with the tools you mentioned, but the first I tried seems friendly & easy to use: OpenProj. It's quite small - just 6.6mb to download.

Andy Hockley said

at 4:21 am on Jan 26, 2014

Thanks to everyone who analysed the badly stated objectives. You've identified what is wrong with them . Just to remind:
1. To improve the English of 7-11 year olds by June 2014

"Improve" means what? It's very vague and not at all specific. Also all 7-11 year olds? Is there a particular group we're talking about. This one needs to be more specific and more measurable. (for example: "To bring the level of the current group of 7-11 year old students up to B1 by the end of June 2014"

To enable 96% of those who wish to enter to get the required score on IELTS/TOEFL to enter the unversity of their choice, by September 2014

As some of you pointed out 96% is unlikely to be realistic. It's certainly measurable but unless we know something special about this intake group, 96% is almost certainly too high

To build a nice wheelchair ramp

"nice" as you have all mentioned is meaningless. This probably needs to be more specific - from where to where is this ramp? From the pavement up to the front door? And it also needs a deadline.

To improve access to the building

Yes, again, not measurable or specific. (or timebound). In fact this is much more like a goal, and the previous objective is the objective. The ramp fulfills the goal of improving access.

Thanks again everyone!
See you in week 3!

Andy H

Andy Curtis said

at 7:08 pm on Jan 26, 2014

Hi Everyone

Just to add to Andy H's feedback, learning a single word in any language is an 'improvement' if you don't know any words to being with! So, some sort of baseline has to be established first, before it can be decided if any improvement has been made.

The second point is about percentages, and in addition to the comments that 96% is unrealistic, they can also be misleading, as percentages are only meaningful with larger numbers. So, if I have two students, and one of them gets into the university if their choice, then that's a 50% success rate! It is, of course, also a 50% failure rate as well!

The third one is my favourite, as "nice" can still a useful word in English, under certain circumstances, but it can also be one of the most ambiguous words in the English language!

For the fourth objective, one of the key parameters would be how "access" is defined. Technically, just opening a window could improve access to a building!

Thais Lobo said

at 2:31 am on Jan 27, 2014


The link to my project is: http://projectmanagementevo2014participants.pbworks.com/w/page/73715858/Thais%27%20Project

I think the Project Gantt Chart will be useful to manage my project. I found a version for Mac users on: http://www.ganttproject.biz/

The objectives are not related to any specific goal because they are generic, and there are not identifiable steps that can be sequenced on a timeline or calendar and assigned to particular people. Hence, they cannot concretise the goal nor make it specific in terms of precisely what is to be accomplished, where and by when.


Cristina said

at 12:22 am on Feb 1, 2014

Cristina said

at 12:32 am on Feb 1, 2014

Hello Everybody,

I´m sorry I´m so delayed with my Project, I know I´m missing a lot of sharing but I´m doing my best to catch up with the group.

As regards the SMART objectives mentioned in Week 2 activities, these are my views:

• To improve the English of 7-11 year olds by June 2014
It´s too general and not achievable because the period of time of too short to assess improvement

• To enable 96% of those who wish to enter to get the required score on IELTS/TOEFL to enter the unversity of their choice, by September 2014
It´s not realistic, too general and, probably, too difficult to fulfil given the high percentage of successful candidates.

• To build a nice wheelchair ramp
• To improve access to the building
They are too general so sound like goals not objectives. They lack the SMART objetives characteristics.

We are keeping in touch very soon, Regards. Cristina

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